Doctor Who

[meganlynn09]

Is the Martha hate driving anyone else crazy? Especially the Martha hate coming out from the latest episode, "Gridlock"?

It's just...it kinda hurts, I know I've said that before. But this is the part that gets me...



Maybe it's just a few people's opinion's, but Martha's insistence at the end of the episode was greatly needed.

Ten admitted to sort of suppressing the memories of what happened, almost pretending it never happened, and it's completely unhealthy.

The fact that people are mad because Martha "unrightfully demanded he talk when he didn't want to" just seems wrong to me.

Shouldn't it be kept in mind that Ten is, on almost all occasions, a bastard and if he really didn't want to talk about it, HE WOULD NOT HAVE DONE SO. He would have left her there for like 30 seconds, came back and take her back home.

BUT HE DIDN'T. No, he sat down and talked very emotionally about Gallifrey. He didn't really put up a fight. It was like he knew it was something he desperately needed to get out, and for the moment, I really felt for him. Ten actually made me cry. *huggles Tennant because finally*

But I think what's really bothersome about some of the Martha haters is that they took this scene that kinda made me love Ten, a scene that was all about the Doctor and made it about Rose! WTF?!

When Martha asked him if the Face of Boe meant her, meant that the Doctor wasn't alone because he had a current companion, it wasn't an stupid question. And the fact that some don't believe Rose would be "selfish" enough to ask the same question, I believe, are wrong. It's not a selfish question in the least! And it's not like Rose EVER assured the Doctor that she had him, no, never.

I'm not down talking about Rose, when the Doctor seemed to deny that Boe's words had any significance towards his own people or whatever, it'd be natural to assume that he meant the Doctor wasn't alone because he had people to travel with. Sure, it's not a big, grand thing, but how was Martha supposed to know that?

*sigh* Maybe I'm just upset with myself because I purposely looked at something that I really should not have. (Does remind me to remove time_and_chips from my f-list though, it's only there because of the occasional good Nine/Rose fic)

Man, this fandom really knows how to get under my skin just right.


Maybe y'all should ignore this one. *HUGS*

Comments

[wordsalone.livejournal.com]

Oh my gods, can people just leave her alone? She wanted answers, what's wrong with that? I happened to love the fact that she demanded the truth from him. Good for her!

Honestly, people are so ridiculous. They're not even giving her a chance. She's going to be around all season, so why not try to like her?

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

I think I may have fallen for Martha after that episode. And it has nothing to do with any past companion, this was all on her own.

I know what you mean, if they don't like her now, I'm sure they aren't going to like her in a couple episodes or to the end of the season!

[kammgirl.livejournal.com]

Well I did hear from non ship biased people that Martha's jealousy was overdone in this episode. That was basically the only criticism I saw. But then I avoid S3 stuff for the most part. But why do you let it bother you? You like her, so who cares what the others think? There are people who will make Martha all about Rose and people who will make Rose all about Martha. There is enough stupidity on all sides. Don't let it get to you.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

Well I did hear from non ship biased people that Martha's jealousy was overdone in this episode.

I really didn't get any jealousy in the episode. A minor annoyance, which considering makes sense.

But anyway, I don't know why I let it get to me. And I sort of don't care what others think, but I guess I would just love it if fandom was more in-sync about things.

I just don't see why people feel the need to consistently compare Rose and Martha. It burns me more than when Gwen from Torchwood was being compared to Rose.

*hugs because you talk sense*

[nina-ds.livejournal.com]

I had an eye-opening experience the other day. I was reading a very good Heroes fic by sam_storyteller, and in the comments, there were a number of DW fans, trying to lure her over to watching some of the Ten episodes. And she just said, "Nah, that fandom's weird" (and she's in HP!) and that Tennant was an odd cookie (can't remember the exact term), and something went off in my head. I always knew this, philosophically, but it hit me - most people who don't like Ten just don't watch!

The Companions are more difficult, but the Companions have kept me watching. Both Rose and Martha have been badly abused just this week in reviews that I've seen. I love them both. It's not like I actually have to choose! They're certainly far more similar than Nine and Ten...

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

I'm really hating all the companion bashing, it never hit me as hard as the Nine/Ten thing, I don't know why. But all this stuff about comparing Rose and Martha and who's better...it's just so bothersome.

I don't know why I read things I shouldn't!

[kammgirl.livejournal.com]

It's not like I actually have to choose!

You are made of wise. I oonly stick to Rose/ship friendly comms and the more I watch old school and listen to audios, I wish there was a place I could go to talk about the old school I watch and ask questions and have discussion. But I would not step foot in any gen DW comm or forum. So I stick to my own LJ.

[prchung.livejournal.com]

in the comments, there were a number of DW fans, trying to lure her over to watching some of the Ten episodes. And she just said, "Nah, that fandom's weird" (and she's in HP!)

*g*
That's pretty funny.

something went off in my head. I always knew this, philosophically, but it hit me - most people who don't like Ten just don't watch!

I'm still watching Ten, but I had something like this happen with the Sixth Doctor back when I was watching in the 80s, I just sort of stopped watching because his mien didn't appeal to my tastes. Now, I'm following up on episodes that I missed all those years ago, and I can appreciate Six a bit more.

[aerynvala.livejournal.com]

I'm completely off track with the fandom if that's how it's going. I really like Martha. And while I wish they'd lay off the are they/aren't they nonsense, that has nothing to do with Rose or Martha or Ten. I'm just not in the mood for that sort of thing these days.

I thought Martha was lovely in Gridlock and I enjoyed the episode a great deal. And yes, Ten needed to talk about his home and his people and Martha gave him the shove he needed in order to do that. So go her! :)

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

Good! This fandom is going to drive me insane, I don't know why I'm still in it.

I don't really like the will they/won't they either, but I really like the Ten/Martha dynamic, so I kinda let it pass.

Oh yes, Martha made me love her madly in Gridlock. I was impressed with how RTD wrote her on her own and how she handled the Doctor. She gets a gold star from me!

[dave7.livejournal.com]

I can't agree enough. (And I think I know exactly what sparked this off. :P)

As far as I'm concerned, the scene was perfect. I loved that Martha pushed - she bloody well should have! Poor girl, being dragged around the cosmos with a sometimes-cranky-alien and no idea what's going on. And the Doctor, finally talking about Gallifrey was just pure win. And I liked that it was with Martha. Yes, in preference to Rose. She's an unbiased ear and maybe a little bit more mature. It really, really annoyed me the way some people reacted. And turning it into something about Rose just cheapens the whole thing, really.

And I'm sorry to barge in on your journal and carry on, but I saw this linked at who_daily and was so relieved that I'm not the only one that I couldn't help myself.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

The scene was perfect! To make me cry for Ten when I didn't like him for nearly a whole season, that's awesome and they're trying to take that away from me. ;)

And turning it into something about Rose just cheapens the whole thing, really.

That's what gets me because the scene isn't even about Martha, it's about the Doctor's loss and pain.

No problem barging in!

[snoopoony.livejournal.com]

I think you should just ignore those people because you see, the problem I have so far with season 3 is the unrequited crush of Martha. I like the girl, I really like her, but my problem with her crush is that it's a perfect symbolism of what's going on in this fandom. When the doctor pushed her away in the first episode or even in the bed scene in the second, I think it was kind of right of him to be it that way, but the fact is... people who loves Martha or feels like everyone is midjuging her because of Rose, will inevitably defends her more and the people who loves Rose, beyond sense, are going to bash Martha as much as they can.
That's why I hate the unrequited crush and think that the 3rd season would have been much better if they hadn't thrown Martha's romantic feelings.

Now, every week, I'm sad to see those posts about how Martha will never be as good as Rose and those posts about how people are annoyed that other people think like that.

I know how much you like Doctor Who, and I really don't want to see you this annoyed or sad or anything every week. You should really let go of this fandom. I don't think it's going to get better...

*HUGS BACK*

[jassanja.livejournal.com]

I don't think that Marthac crush will last much longer.
She admitted in Gridlock that she was seeing more in the Doctor then he does in her. That's usually the point most people get over crushed

To the main post:
I think the Martha Bashing is a Time and Chips thing. I have not seen it on any other place.
Right now I avoid the Ten/Rose shippers just as one would avoid the Harry/Hermione shippers in HP

[arefadedaway.livejournal.com]

Team Martha/Rose, fandom. Make love, not war!

I'm not surprised, but it's still getting under my skin more than it should. I can't contemplate how anyone could have any sort of objections to Martha's last scene. Ten needed someone to push him into admitting how immature his actions were, and thank fuck someone finally had the initiative to not put up with his rot.

Oh, Martha, you are wondrous. Especially your eyebrows. But also your resourcefulness and not-putting-up-with-shit skills.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

That's a fic I'd read, Martha and Rose meeting and comparing notes. Although, personally, it'd be Rose from Nine's time.

I just loved that scene so much and it makes me want to cry to see how anyone can just hate it because it's Martha. WHY ARE YOU TAKING THE SCENE AWAY FROM THE DOCTOR?

[kazzy.livejournal.com]

Man, this fandom really knows how to get under my skin just right.

The last few week I've been raging in my own journal to similar effect. It gets right under there and bites hard doesn't it. And yes, time_and_chips is one of the worst places.

Unfortunately from what I've seen the Rose bashing is about on par with the Martha bashing. So, don't worry, it isn't only Martha who is getting attacked. It's both of them. There are so many people in this fandom who think that it is impossible to like both of them at the same time.

I loved Rose. And I really like what I've seen of Martha so far. People don't seem to be able to grasp that.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

I thought time_and_chips was okay until this episode.

It makes me sad that either character needs to be "attacked". I don't understand how people are thinking they can't like Martha because they love/d Rose so much. They're two different people, just like in real life, you can like them both!

[doyle_sb4.livejournal.com]

And the fact that some don't believe Rose would be "selfish" enough to ask the same question, I believe, are wrong. It's not a selfish question in the least! And it's not like Rose EVER assured the Doctor that she had him, no, never.



I think Rose would definitely have asked if Boe meant her; for one thing, she already *did* say "you've got me" in response to Nine’s “I’m all alone” in the last scene of End of the World, and for another you’ve got to establish that “You Are Not Alone” actually means something for the rest of the season rather than the obvious interpretation that of course he’s not alone, there’s someone traveling with him. If Boe’s death and message had been in New Earth as originally intended, Rose would have had to suggest it meant her and get shot down exactly the same as Martha.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

Totally agree. It's not a pointed message, so of course someone could think they meant that the Doctor had companions to travel with him.

[schizojuc.livejournal.com]

There's Martha hate because of Martha's insistence that the Doctor talk to her? Did they even watch the show and understand why she wanted him to talk?

She tells her kidnappers that she does not know much about the man she had trusted completely to come to a whole different time. She realises how much trust she had in him and wants him to have as much in her and tell her things about himself. That is understandable and very *human*!

The Martha haters much be part Daleks.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

I wish some of the people would actually watch the show!

I completely understood where she was coming from, and then you add to that the fact the Doctor needed to talk, then that last scene was just perfection.

HA! You may be on to something.

[nostalgia-lj.livejournal.com]

The silver lining is that companions now get the respect and Too Much Love that they deserve?

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

I don't know if I really want to count that as a silver lining.

It's kinda sad that they're turning something about the Doctor to be about the Companion. Shouldn't we be happy that there's a good amount of focus on the Doctor? Isn't that what we wanted?

[malaleen.livejournal.com]

I'm just tired of all the craziness over Rose/Martha. I still, in theory, enjoy the Doctor/Rose ship, but the more I see coming out of T&C lately, the less I'm enjoying it. Re-writing the last scene of Gridlock because they thought Rose would react better, crazy theories that Rose will return because of a random poster that is a very bad translation of Bad Wolf in Japanese/Chinese...will the craziness ever stop?

All I want to do is enjoy Martha and S3. Is that too much to ask of fandom? I'm ready to move on with companions and just wish people would do the same, instead of clinging to insane theories that Rose is some how going to return.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

I love Nine/Rose madly, and could hardly tolerate Ten/Rose, so this is driving me even more insane.

crazy theories that Rose will return because of a random poster that is a very bad translation of Bad Wolf in Japanese/Chinese

That just made me laugh, honestly. People are STILL forgetting that Billie decided to leave the show, and no matter what she said about it being left open, she's not really going to come back.

I'm not saying people should let go of their ship, but they should realize that the show is moving on.

YES, everyone should just take this, enjoy what they're getting or just stop watching.

[eclecticmuse.livejournal.com]

I haven't seen much Martha-bashing, but that's probably because I avoid time_and_chips like the plague now. The bashing I have seen is just ridiculous because it simply equates to MARTHA =/= ROSE SO H8888. Heck, I just read a fic where the author retconned stuff so Ten told Rose about Gallifrey first and then repeated it all to Martha at the end of Gridlock. That annoyed me.

I mean, I like the Doctor/Rose ship fine, but all the glorified Rose love is starting to make me dislike it. Plus I just think Martha works better with Ten. Oh well.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

That is just...I don't know what to think anymore. It bothers me that some people think that because Martha isn't Rose, they have to hate her, and then those that feel the opposite. Because Martha isn't Rose, they love her.

Oh yes, I definitely think Martha works better with Ten.

I somehow find it amusing that some shippers actually avoid time_and_chips. I can't believe it's gotten that bad.

[bluekiwibubble.livejournal.com]

I have...not actually seen any Martha hate. =S Is it all on time_and_chips or something? I don't go there, would be why...but you're right, he needed to talk, and it was really lovely to hear about Gallifrey, and you'd think the writers backing up old school stuff and that would make people happy, and not make them whinge about the new companion. And it was only her third episode, surely if people don't like her they should still give her a chance, at least for a while.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

You're lucky. :P

Um..some of it was on that comm, some isn't. It's just sad that some people just can't be pleased.

[infiniteviking]

There's Martha hate!? *boggles*

I did think it was a bit soon for the whole emotional outpouring thing, but when I watched that scene Rose was the last matter that was on my mind. The scene was a good one that needed to happen, whether now or later. So Martha demanded that the Doctor talk things out with her. If he felt no attachment to her, he wouldn't have bothered to open up. If she didn't care, she wouldn't have insisted. Especially with the Doctor's skepticism at the Face's revelation, that catharsis (do pardon the word XD) was exactly what he needed. Putting Rose in the equation is simply missing the point.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

Completely agree! Rose isn't in any way a part of that scene, and Martha is barely a part of that scene, she was just the one to get the Doctor to start talking.

[azarsuerte.livejournal.com]

Honestly? After surviving the last two years of The X-Files' run, I've learned to just ignore it. I was a Doggett fan, and even got put on a watchlist of fanfic authors for "true" XF fans not to read because I wrote fic that portrayed him in a positive light! It was so ridiculous that those of us who'd been on the list made ourselves little award badges to put on our site proclaiming that we'd been "flamed for Doggett." :-)

But unfortunately the end result of those two years was that the fandom left such a bitter taste in my mouth, I now can't go back and watch the show. Even the episodes I loved, even the ones *with* Doggett. That's not an experience I care to repeat, so these days if I see something that sounds like character bashing, I swing a wide arc in the opposite direction.

And it's not because I don't understand that losing a character you love still hurts--I'm pretty heartbroken myself right now over spoilers that my favorite character on another show is being written out, and NOT at the actor's request. But why would I waste time hating their replacement when I'm perfectly capable of choosing *not* to watch anymore if I don't like the direction they take the new characters in?

*sigh* Life is stressful enough without throwing that log on the fire.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

Goodness, if there was ever a time I was glad I was too young to be in the XF fandom.

I know what you mean about your fave character being written out of a show, it seems to be happening on too many shows, one of mine included. The fact that it's not at the actor's request just makes it worse, I think.

But you're right, it's just a waste to hate their "replacement" on principle.

I wish some of these people would let go of the show or fandom. But that's just a little selfish thinking of mine. :D

[prchung.livejournal.com]

I was really impressed by "Gridlock". It's currently in my list of favorite episodes (s1 to present), and I didn't have problem at all with Martha. If anything I'm probably warming up to her a bit more now that she and the Doctor appear more comfortable together. She's getting her TARDIS legs and it shows.

The ending of the ep was really well done. I appreciated how she stood, or rather sat, her ground and demanded he talk to her. It levels the playing field, and gives the Doctor some relief.

[meganlynn09.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I was pretty impressed with "Gridlock" myself, kinda of made me feel like "The Long Goodbye" (my secret crush episode). I just adored it and the ending made it completely worth it.

And I think Martha just earned my respect there at the end.